car will not start...

Basic tech questions such as future setups, different turbo kits, car diagnosis, etc
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Ok guys I cant seem to find what the fcuk is going on with my 40...I drove it to work, left for lunch, and then drove home with no problem at all. I woke up to go to work and would not turn over at all just clicking, so I figured the battery went dead from it getting so cold out side and put the charger on and still just clicking. I have checked battery connections, starter, replaced starter solenoid, wires are all tight, it just doesnt make any sense. only thing left is maybe a broken wire which I read the black and yellow stripe wire that hooks to the solenoid may be the cause but it wasnt broken...it was an auto to 5 speed swap if that matters or means anything, and I feel a tapping in the clutch pedal when I try to start it and the clicking noise occurs... anyone ever had this problem? also if i pop start it with the key in the on position it will fire right up and run with no problems.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
basic
Dont Question My Nissan Knowledge
Posts: 663
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:03 pm
Location: Eastern Iowa.

Re: car will not start...

Post by basic »

did you try the old hit the starter with a hammer/pipe trick? I had issues like this before and hitting the starter fixed it temp. Ended up being the starter - even though it would spin free out of the car, once it had a load on it, just clicks.
'87 200SX Hatch - complete with KA24DE swap.
'91 240SX hatch complete with super rare sunroof insert and bag.
chubbza5 wrote:Well hey, truck engine + truck turbo, why not!
User avatar
OnTheChip
240sx Wannabe
Posts: 196
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2010 12:36 pm
Location: Burgaw, NC
Contact:

Re: car will not start...

Post by OnTheChip »

Yep, sure sounds like a starter solenoid problem.
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

I pulled the starter and put a new solenoid on a brand new starter maybe 800 miles on it and when I used a battery on it it hits hard and spins free but when I put the start back in it just clicks so I tried to jump the starter with the key in the "on" position like I would be pop starting it and it will not turn over it just clicks I dont understand what the hell is going on. it like a short in the ignition system from the key to the solenoid there has to be a short or broken wire or something its really got me mind fcuked real good.....
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
neverlift
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 263
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:35 am
Location: fla

Re: car will not start...

Post by neverlift »

a quick way to verify that the starter works on car is to run a fused wire from 12volts to the small single wire. This will also tell you if you have a wiring related issue in the ignition circuit. If the starter cranks this way you either have a bad switch or wiring between A and B.
Image
User avatar
airman
KA-T.org OWNER
Posts: 2144
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:51 pm
Location: Anderson, SC

Re: car will not start...

Post by airman »

neverlift wrote:a quick way to verify that the starter works on car is to run a fused wire from 12volts to the small single wire. This will also tell you if you have a wiring related issue in the ignition circuit. If the starter cranks this way you either have a bad switch or wiring between A and B.
This is a very good tip. This is the easiest way to rule out battery/starter and begin your focus on wiring if it works.

Make sure your ignition is in the ON position though if you're ok with it starting during this test.
R.I.P. 1990 Red Hatch - DOHC 5 speed // CP 9:1 - Eagle Rods - Clevite - ARP // Holset HX35 - 20psi daily - MSPNP2
8-bit wrote:You could spend your life building a ladder to the moon, or work for 5 years to pay for a trip.
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

ok kool I will do that its been in the teens here and I fcukin hate the cold so hopfully I will get to do something tomorrow after work. thanks for the help and ill post up what the problem was when/if I track it down.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
rickeybobby
Learners Permit
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Jan 13, 2014 6:12 pm
Location: ashland, OR

Re: car will not start...

Post by rickeybobby »

clutch cancel switch on clutch pedal would be the first place i would look. second i would check the big white wire with a black stripe going to the ignition switch for bad connections i.e. alarm system, turbo timer, etc. or stupid ignition relay(starter relay)
N/A
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Hi 500hpKA240sx, did you ever got to solve the problem?

I´m having the same problem on my KA24ET, some times starts without any issues, but when it starts, i noticed, it sounds like its struggling... and some other times, nothing, just the click when i turn the key! I have checked the battery and its good and strong, i haven´t tested anything else because the car has been satrting fine for the last 4 days!


Thanks :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Ended up being the ground wire on the battery... Took it off and split the coating and the wire inside fell apart just old. Replace it and it will prolly be fine
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Glad you found the solution for you :)

I forgot to say, i relocated my battery to the trunk, used brand new and thicker cables!
User avatar
airman
KA-T.org OWNER
Posts: 2144
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2009 12:51 pm
Location: Anderson, SC

Re: car will not start...

Post by airman »

The most common cause for starter "click" issues comes down to voltage. The next biggest one is a solenoid problem. I've had a brand new (albeit remanned) alternator from an auto parts chain store. The component that makes the gear "leap" forward is good, but the component that is supposed to say "Okay, we're good to start spinning now", aka the brushes, are bad. This is why whacking the solenoid can help free this condition, but is never a permanent solution.

This is a very handy method to check if you have a voltage problem and it helps you pinpoint the problem wire(s). Voltage drop shouldn't be more than about ~0.5V when cranking. Everyone needs a multimeter! :)

http://youtu.be/ry68G0C2Fyc

Work smarter, not harder.
R.I.P. 1990 Red Hatch - DOHC 5 speed // CP 9:1 - Eagle Rods - Clevite - ARP // Holset HX35 - 20psi daily - MSPNP2
8-bit wrote:You could spend your life building a ladder to the moon, or work for 5 years to pay for a trip.
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

I tested the battery voltage before a took it out the garage 5 days ago!

The car was sitting on the garage for about 3 weeks, battery disconnected, so i tested it and read 12.5v, then conected the cables and started the engine, started at the second turn of the key, and with it running it read 13.9v!?

What do you think about this numbers??


Thanks :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Everything's working fine your alt is charging at a level it should be it should never be over 14-14.5...only time you should have an over driven alt pulley to be charging at that level is if your pushing 3 big comp amps and your drawing power faster than your alt can charge. So back to the problem... Did you do a continuity test on the ground wires the one going from the neg. Battery terminal to the frame?
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

I haven´t tested the continuity, i´ll have to do that, what numbers should i see on the multimeter?

Thank you :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

you wont see any numbers. you go to one end and put either prong to the wire and then go to the terminal and put the other prong on it and the meter "depending on what one you have" it will either light up or beep. typically it will make a constant beep. but even if it does beep it doesnt mean the wire is necessarily good on the inside. what would be an easy test is to take another wire "copper would be best" and run it from the neg terminal to the strut tower bolt and just see if that stops the no start. like airman said also it could be the starter solenoid not wanting to thrust the gear on to the fly wheel. what you can do is have someone hold the multimeter on the solenoid post one side should be hot and the other side should be nothing thats where starting it comes into play, once your key is in the start position "all the way forward" it completes the circuit allowing power to pass through. make sure the multimeter is on DC and while someone is holding the black/neg to a ground and the red/pwr to the NON hot side of the solenoid go hit your key and when the car starts/turns over you should see 12v and as soon as you let go of the key it will go away. if you encounter the "click" and your not getting power to the solenoid then you have a bad wire some where, if you get the "click" and it spikes to 12v id say your start solenoid is bad.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Ok, so i just tested the continuity on the negative/ground wire and it´s ok, as far as the multimeter says, gives a constant beep!

About testing the solenoid, and to be honest, i didn´t understand your explanation :( Sorry
Can i test it without removing it from the car? I can see a bolted cable that looks like its on the solenoid, i think it´s the ground cable!

Thanks for all the help you have been giving me :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Shoot me a text or call and I can explain it better. 636 667 7756 names Kyle
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Ok, so i tested the solenoid, from what i was able to see, the solenoid has 2 screw type pins, one is for the battery cable and the other has a cable that goes to the starter, i measured them both, and with the engine off, the battery cable pin reads 12.7V and when its started, drops to 9.0V and goes up to 13.4V!
The other pin (for the starter) reads 0.0V, when the key is turned to start the engine, and the engine starts, it goes up to arround 9.0V and back to 0.0V, and when it does not start, happened once, i get NO voltage on the multimeter!

What do you think??


Thanks
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

So hard to diagnose electrical through a forum are you getting signal from your key to the solenoid?....its sounds like the solenoid is bad to me.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

I understand you, it´s very hard :(
Can you tell me how can i test the signal from key to solenoid? If i read you post correctely, i should be getting a 12V peak on start up (on the solenoid to starter pin), and not 9V, right?

Thanks for the help
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

I'm at work right now ill check when I get home ill make a video and post it. Not sure on the 9v part.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Thanks man :) you´r the best :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Image now in the vid when its spiking to like 10.5v or so that's passing power from the hot side to the starter side. If it spikes and is clicking or not letting power pass through at all when it clicks the solenoid is prolly shot...
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

On my test, i didn´t conected the black probe on my battery, because it´s on the trunk, i used the suspension structure!
I tested like on the video, and on the solenoids battery pin (Hot side) i get 12.7V, on the other pin (Non hot side), 0.0V!
When i turn on the engine, i get a spiking to about 9.0V on the Non hot side!

I´m not sure if i made the readings correctly, here´s a pic of my multimeter,

Image

i made my readings in volts, upper left side, next to the off position, black probe on the "COM" socket and the red one on the "V" socket, right one!

Thanks :)
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

Its passing connection like it should maybe a little low so I'm still leaning towards the solenoid. And I just used the neg battery terminal as my ground b/c I could stick it there and hold my camera I need some alligator clips but non the less your doing it fine a chassis ground is still a ground.
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Ok, thanks for your video and help, tomorrow i´ll do some more readings, and i will probably wait until the engine gives me another click/no start situation, so i can check the numers!
I will remove the starter/solenoid from the engine and take it to a shop, to fix it!

I was wondering if this could be a ignition switch problem or the switch under the clutch pedal going bad or even the starter relay?
I might be able to check this parts as well!

Thank you
User avatar
500hpKA240sx
Encyclopedia-Nissan
Posts: 1100
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:37 pm
Location: Bourbon, MO

Re: car will not start...

Post by 500hpKA240sx »

It wont be your clutch shut off switch put your car in neutral and don't push the clutch in and then turn the key it won't click. If it were bad it would do the same thing. The clicking your hearing is the solenoid trying to engage the starter. There are two screws in the solenoid from the opposite side of the terminal post, take them off and pull the solenoid out. It can be tricky to put back on sometimes but nothing to hard. Pull the plunger out and the spring behind it and use some emery cloth on the plunger and the inside of the solenoid with some wd40 or something similar and clean it all up and put it back on it prolly take care of your problem
viewtopic.php?t=53160&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Paul Walker- 1973-2013 Race In Paradise. you will be forever missed
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Thanks 500hpKA240sx, i tried starting the engine without pressing the clutch, and no click :) then i pressed the clutch, turned the key and started right away, so the switch is working :)

I´ll try pulling the starter out and do the fix you described and see if it solves the problem :) i´ll let you know how it works out


Thanks :)
User avatar
Drift Racer
Knows Some Stuff About 240's!
Posts: 222
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:41 am
Location: Ericeira, Portugal

Re: car will not start...

Post by Drift Racer »

Hi there, pulling this from the dead :)

So i took the starter to a repair shop, the guy tested it, it was working fine, he opened it and cleaned everything, i installed it back in the engine and it started fine for a couple of days, then, no start again, like i have the battery on the trunk, i´m going to check the ground, add a ground from the engine to the frame and replace the ground wire from the battery to the trunk (i´m using the stock cable)! I´m also thinking on testing the interlock relay!
Post Reply