How To: Convert from A/T to M/T

travizx0r · Post by **travizx0r** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 3:33 pm

ok i really need some input on this. im thinking about buying a 97 se that is auto and just convert it to a manual. i really dont know where to get all the parts for the swap since there isnt an abundance of 240s here in alabama. if i do the swap i want everything to be as if it came factory pretty much with a 5 speed.

JDM RICE · Post by **JDM RICE** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:10 pm

best place to check are junkyards and message boards.

i lucked out and had a buddy who's 97 se 5 speed got rear-ended and I'm getting all of his stuff, so its gonna be a straight forward install

travizx0r · Post by **travizx0r** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:35 am

damn your lucky. i found a auction that ends today that i may bid on. tell me if you think this is a good deal, its out of a 95 5 speed.
- Complete 5 speed transmission

- Driveshaft

- ECU

- Clutch pedal and brake pedal assemblies

- Flywheel (Included but not pictured)

- Clutch master cylinder

- Slave cylinder

- Shifter

- Transmission crossmember (needs new bushing - may be the same as your auto bushing - not sure)

- All oil lines from master cylinder to slave cylinder

- Almost all nuts and bolts are included

i think thats everything that i need but im not sure. any input on this would be greatly appreciated. also would that be straight forward as in swaping it out?

oh yeah ill plan to bid up to 500 for it if its a good deal

NiSSanFreAk · Post by **NiSSanFreAk** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:09 pm

Well the swap is pretty straight forward. If you cant do this conversion i dont think u should b on this site. But heres the thing, as far as the ecu goes, I think u have to wire up your sensor (5th gear sensor, etc...), i was able to wire up my reverse light and speed sensor no problem with my auto ecu. So im not sure if its worth the trouble to put the manual ecu in. Although iv heard that with the auto ecu in the manual car, the car is sappose to idle kinda rough in the winter time. But i found out that that was total **** since i made it through a wisconsin winter just fine with no such occurences.

And for the tranny conversion for 500$, that would be a good deal, but ur gonna get ur ass kicked in shipping. I think i payed about 500-600 total for my swap, when i was quoted about 1000$ for the whole job. So it depends on where you source your parts from.

PhantomSin01 · Post by **PhantomSin01** » Sun Apr 17, 2005 3:00 pm

Id keep the auto ECU. It doesnt have a speed cut out like the Manual ECU does

Michigan240sx · Post by **Michigan240sx** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:35 am

Hey Guys,

This thread has answered a lot of questions for me about my s14 manual conversion, but I have a few more...

My friend has a 91 240sx and is replacing his manual tranny. He told me he would sell it for 100 bucks, and I will just buy the new parts to rebuild it. So my first question is how to hook the speed sensor for the s14 to the s13 tranny? I have also heard that you have to use a manual ecu on the s14, you can only use the auto ecu on the s13. Is this true?

And does anybody know how hard it is to drill the s13 manual tranny to mount the s14 crank position sensor so I don't keep throwing codes.

Anybody know where to get a cheap clutch kit, flywheel, clutch master and slave cylinder?

Thanks for the help guys.

nil5 · Post by **nil5** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 8:18 am

And does anybody know how hard it is to drill the s13 manual tranny to mount the s14 crank position sensor so I don't keep throwing codes.

Try connecting the speedo signal to the CKPS input on the ECU. I think that might work since I doubt the ECU is doing anything more sophisticated than testing for the presence of an AC signal, but it's untested as of yet. Let us know if that stops the codes, or if it doesn't, since that would give a better idea of how the ECU processes/interprets that signal.

see: viewtopic.php?t=3378[/quote]

travizx0r · Post by **travizx0r** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 10:39 am

what can i use from a s13 in my s14 without problems for my swap. i cant find the pedals, crossmember, and driveshaft from a s14 to use and i was really wondering if the the pedals would work and if so do i just get the clutch pedal or do i need brake and clutch?

SleepyS-14 · Post by **SleepyS-14** » Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:00 pm

get the clutch and brake pedal then it will look alot cleaner. Also if you need a little help on the wiring(even though its easy) use this. Very detailed and I used it with no problems in my 95. The only thing I had trouble with was finding a driveshaft.

http://www.ka24development.com/cwilfert ... rical.html

This should clear up the wiring part of it.

SleepyS-14 · Post by **SleepyS-14** » Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:03 pm

you can use all of the s-13 parts except for the driveshaft. And i used my stock auto interior shift piece and just dremeled it the the right size. Looks better than the stock manual peice.

PhantomSin01 · Post by **PhantomSin01** » Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:46 pm

Ok, im finishing up my swap and Ive run into a problem with the wiring. Im trying to figure out where the green/yellow and green/blue wires are for the reverse sensor.

Also, im having trouble with bleeding the clutch, the pedal just doesnt want to get full pressure, Ive readjusted the pedal, blead the slave cylender and the dampener, But the damn thing just doesnt want to gain pressure. And there are no holes in the line.

NiSSanFreAk · Post by **NiSSanFreAk** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 9:33 pm

Kill the damper, its useless, bypass it and bend the hardline right into the rubber line, it will be a bit more straight forward for you and you get a direct feel to the clutch. Also if you bought a used master or slave, u may have bad seals on them if theve been sitting in a junk yard for ever. I ended up replacing the seals in my master and buying a new slave. GL!

PhantomSin01 · Post by **PhantomSin01** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 3:44 pm

Thanks, I did that a couple hours after I posted the message.
Its acting up now, Is it ungodly important that the bushing come out of the crankshaft? because I broke my pilot bushing trying to put it in, I didnt sand it down or clean the crank. I got another one from the dealer for 5 bucks.

NiSSanFreAk · Post by **NiSSanFreAk** » Sat Jul 02, 2005 8:10 pm

yea pullers arent to expensive. i would get that out asap

struka · Post by **struka** » Fri Jul 22, 2005 4:41 pm

what parts out of the S13 KA24DE fit the S14?
does the drive shaft match up and the manual bolts?

struka · Post by **struka** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 9:45 am

also what about the subframe? anyone?

PhantomSin01 · Post by **PhantomSin01** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:34 pm

S13 subframe fits up, Adam. As long as its a MT subframe.

delinquentracer · Post by **delinquentracer** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:18 am

So the M/T s13 driveshaft will not work in the S14?

Cuz if so... thats the only thing holding me back.

Cuz I got my S13 LSD to fit up fine.. by switching the back plate/cover, in my non-SE S14.

And I still have not found a definite answer to this s13 driveshaft in the s14 question...
one person said it wont. BUt i need more evidence.

delinquentracer · Post by **delinquentracer** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:25 am

i know that the s13 driveshaft will not work with the s14 tranny, but since the s13 tranny works with the s14.. is it possible to just use my s13 driveshaft with my s13 tranny in my s14???
Especially since i have a s13 lsd in my s14...

fos240 · Post by **fos240** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:30 am

sorry i'm coming in late to answer these questions.

no the s13 drive shaft will not work in a s14 chasis. the carrier bearing on a s13 is on the front half section while the s14 carrier bearing is on the rear section. the s13 uses a god aweful 6 bolt flange with a rubber isolator where the s14 has a universal joint just past the yoke.
some other points to note.

the dust sheilds between the s13 and s14 are different. those need to be changed or removed if using them in the other chasis car. each drive shaft will work with the other tranny if the dust shield is changed. the splines are the same (as is all the other internals) between each of the ka tranny's.

the s14 tranny's have a crank angle sensor bolted in the top. make sure this is removed before trying to take the tranny out. (unless you need a new one anyway.) the s13 tranny does not have a provision for the crank angle. you can drill and tap for it, but it's just easier to find another tranny.

the s13 and s14 clutch and brake pedals are different. on the s13 the spacers for the pedals are on the firewall where on the s14 the spacers are on the pedals themselves. you can cut the spacers off the s14 pedals and use them in a s13. you'd have to be pretty creative to make the s13 pedals work in a s14.

whenever i do a 5 speed conversion, i wire the park neutral wires to the clutch interlock switch to keep the car from cranking while the clutch is not depressed.

the speed sensors between the s13 and s14 tranny's are the same as far as fitting in the tranny, but the s13 has a long wire than runs up close to the starter before getting plugged in. the s14 speed sensor doesn't have a wire at all. it just has the plug and the tranny harness runs all the way to it.

as for the automatic bushing in the crank. that HAS to come out. it's a huge pita. you'll rather get kicked in the nuts by every friend you have before having to get another one out. especially if the engine is still in the car and you don't have a lift. i know of one crack head who forced a pilot bushing inside the automatic bushing and then dremeled the inside enough for the input shaft to slide into. it only took 2 days for the pilot bushing to slide past the automatic bushing. then the input shaft flexed and made god aweful noises while the engine was under load.

frankie

Poorboy · Post by **Poorboy** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:48 pm

i thought i would jump in here and just see if anyone can settle my concerns before i spend a bunch of money on some swap parts.

i have a base model, no abs, no nothin, automatic 97 240sx

the donor car is a 1990 240sx

i plan on using all the necessary parts from the donor car. i'm getting a fair price i believe at $225 for everything i need.

what i plan on is keeping my auto ecu and wiring whatever up to that.

what functions will i lose if i do this?

are there any parts that for sure will NOT work. i've heard people say the flywheel will and wont work. i've heard people say the driveshafts will and wont work, i've read that the pedals might not work, and even people say the tranny's wont work.

also? when i purchase a clutch kit (assuming i go through with this), will i need to buy a specific one for the year of the donor car, or of my car?

-thanks so much!

orion · Post by **orion** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:14 pm

I can tell you FOR SURE that:

Driveshaft WILL NOT work...S14 is longer.

Pedals will fit, but you have to use washers/spacers...I would find a set of S14 pedals.

You'll need to buy a S14 speed sensor.

You'll have a CEL unless you add a crankshaft position sensor to the bellhousing...you'll need to drill the hole and locate it properly...but you can reuse your auto crankshaft pos. sensor.

Etc, etc...

IMO, find an S14 to get the parts from...even if you pay more, at least it'll be done "right".

- Brian

fos240 · Post by **fos240** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:36 pm

Poorboy wrote: are there any parts that for sure will NOT work. i've heard people say the flywheel will and wont work. i've heard people say the driveshafts will and wont work, i've read that the pedals might not work, and even people say the tranny's wont work.

also? when i purchase a clutch kit (assuming i go through with this), will i need to buy a specific one for the year of the donor car, or of my car?

-thanks so much!

please read my post on page 2. the flywheel will work. the tranny will work if you don't care about the crank angle trigger and remove the dust shield. (this was gone over in the post.)

one thing i did forget to mention in the first post. there are 3 different tranny cross members. they have letter designations A, B, and C stamped in them. there is no rhyme or reason to which one is used. (or rather i haven't figured it out yet.)

frankie

JDM RICE · Post by **JDM RICE** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:21 pm

let me chime in again on my 97 se 5spd conversion

everything is straight forward!

the automatic pilot bearing is a bi*ch to remove! i think i sat and looked at it for an entire day...lol

a) pilot bearing removal tool doesn't work, not for me atleast
b) greese method did not work either

c) the winner, drilling the sides of the pilot bearing till it eventually collapses. from the rear of the car towards the front. came out in minutes

wiring the reverse lights is a gimme

5th position sensor, and neutral position sensor are REQUIRED or else you will throw codes.

5 spd ecu is is needed, the auto ecu has no circuitry to read the 5th position sensor nor the neutral position sensor.

there is more, i will edit them in as i remember

Poorboy · Post by **Poorboy** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:03 pm

thats very informative guys, thanks!!!

its not what i wanted to hear but, i'd rather do it right and pay a little more than have my car throwing codes all day long.

-kl- · Post by **-kl-** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 5:37 pm

i'm doing a swap on my 97

i have a 96 ecu, it came with a package i bought. but i'm thinking i should just use the 97 auto ecu instead of the 96.

the 96 tranny i got had no sensors or switches on it

1.) what sensors and switches are needed to run safely with the 96 tranny and 97 auto ecu?
speed sensor, reverse sensor, what else do i need?

2.) i'm going to buy a 97 manual ecu later down the line, is it just the ecu i need or am i going to have to buy harness for it?

3.) i bought a clutch kit from Exedy, are there two parts to the bearing?

help would be greatly appreciated.. my car has been down for over 2 weeks now

Toph · Post by **Toph** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:15 pm

anyone ever try to use the auto speed sensor in the manual tranny? it's bigger and I don't see how I could trim it down and still have it properly seal.

zilvia4eva · Post by **zilvia4eva** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 4:25 pm

Hey, my turn

I have a auto 95 base model with abs and vlsd.

I got a deal from a local junkyard for all the parts needed to do the swap under $225(5spd tranny,flywheel,hardlines,clutch cylinder,brake & clutch pedals,5spd lower harness,complete drive shaft assembly)this all came from a 95 se non-abs.

My question is can I use the 5spd non-abs drive shaft on my car even though it has abs?I've been told that all I really need is the front piece of the 5spd drive shaft assembly and it should work fine,is this true?

Toph · Post by **Toph** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:54 pm

yep the front half is all you need. the front half is different from a/t to m/t and the rear half is different from abs to non-abs. either way you'll be fine...I have a s13 vlsd on my non-abs driveshaft with no problems...there's enough play in the system to accommodate the difference.

lopro240 · Post by **lopro240** » Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:07 pm

So if what i read is correct. Than I can swap the flywheel, and flywheel bolts, bell housing, transmission, transmission mount, and driveshaft, from a 1990 sohc to my 1993 dohc??? There are slight differences but it will work fine? Also, what about the starter I would have to change my automatic start to a 5spd starter and thats about it right. Please let me know I have a guy with a junker 1990 at the yard waiting on my call back. Wish i found this car sooner it had an aftermarket turbo kit in it. Dont know why the guy junked the car, body was pretty straight. The guy said the car was fast he drove it before they started selling stuff off of it.

www.ka-t.org

How To: Convert from A/T to M/T

98 240sx Swap Question