Maxima COP Triggering

Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:07 pm

I found this write up, but it is for the PNP MS, and I am running MS1 v3.0 board so I wanted to clarify something:

I am not sure what the Spark A and B outputs really are (if they are conditioned) on the PNP ECU. Can the maxima coils be driven directly from the LED's? Aren't those LED's always powered and then the transistors (Q6 and Q8) switch to ground to light them?

Or do the coils need a 5v pull up like this?:
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/MS_ ... htm#5Vpull

Thanks for the help!
Last edited by Spoolin6er on Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Kill3rwill » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:33 pm

EDIT: i am an idiot who didnt read. i dont believe the DIY boards come with the necesarry outputs from the factory. the MSPNP's use a microsquirt module, but i think you can buy the add on board to run wasted spark.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:05 pm

Thanks for the quick reply, but I'm pretty sure I don't need a daughter board to get this to work... worst case I need to build a pull up circuit.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:15 am

You will need to modify the ECU for two 5 volt logic level outputs.

http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/MS_ ... .htm#cop30

Either the "5V Pull Up to fire" or "Ground switching" mod on that page can work.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:28 pm

interesting. So the pnp ms2 (found in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=60105 ) already has one of those circuits built in an output on pin 2 and 3 of the expansion DB15? Which circuit does it use? I'd like to emulate that since its known to work.

(sorry, realized i some how missed putting the write up link in my first post. Now edited.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:34 am

As the MSPNP is based on the MicroSquirt Module, it does not quite fit any of these categories. Its output circuit is most closely related to the "5V Pull Up to Fire", but is not an exact match.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Tue Apr 07, 2015 6:47 pm

interesting. Can you explain the difference? Is there any reason that using the pull up circuit might not work in place of the microsquirt output?
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:12 am

We are using a variant of the "5V pull up to fire" circuit that has been adapted to the MicroSquirt Module and has a 22 ohm resistor added inline to prevent killing the transistor if the output is shorted to ground.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Fri May 08, 2015 7:03 am

So tried to start it up last night with the new COP's. When I turned the key to ON the coils got hot. I was using Spark Inverted = Yes as the how to suggested (link in previous post). I switched it to NO and the coils aren't getting hot, but the engine won't start. (Didn't try to start with inverted = yes)

Is there any reason why the PNP would use inverted=Yes, and i would need to use inverted=NO? Trying to figure out if its related to my engine not starting (seems to try and start but the timing sounds off, still working on checking that)
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Fri May 08, 2015 7:18 am

The MSPNP is set up so that "Going high" means it sends a 0 volt signal when off and 5 volts when dwelling the coil. Some circuits in the MS1/Extra manual use the opposite logic.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Wed May 13, 2015 11:12 am

Interesting, I am using this circuit: http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/MS_Extra_Ignition_Hardware_Manual.htm#5Vpull

Which if i'm reading correctly "goes high" when dwelling the coils correct? Unless i did something horribly wrong.

I bring this up because I am apparently doing something wrong with these coils. While trying to start I am getting controller resets to the point that it won't stay running. I assumed it was my power wiring or noise in that wiring so I have wired the MS and CAS power to a completely separate 12v power source for trouble shooting. And I still got controller resets. So i unplugged the coils - NO more controller resets...

Thoughts?
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Fri May 15, 2015 6:20 am

That circuit needs to be set to going low.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Sat May 16, 2015 8:13 pm

Matt Cramer wrote:The MSPNP is set up so that "Going high" means it sends a 0 volt signal when off and 5 volts when dwelling the coil. Some circuits in the MS1/Extra manual use the opposite logic.

Can you clarify this? I have read elsewhere that going high means that 0v charges the coil and then when the signal goes back high it fires? Does this going high/low terminology differ from coils to coil and/or MS version?

Any thoughts on how my coils being plugged in could be causing resets?

Thanks
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Tue May 19, 2015 10:47 am

Going low vs going high refers to what the MegaSquirt is doing at the processor pins. Some output circuits reverse what actually happens to the signal by the time it makes it to the harness. The MegaSquirt CPU is not aware of what circuitry may be downstream of the processor pins.
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Tue May 19, 2015 1:46 pm

Ah,I see where I was getting confused. Thanks.

Any ideas why having my coils plugged in would cause resets that don't occur when I unplug them?

I even powered/grounded the MS from a separate 12v source to try and eliminate possible noise or cranking voltage drop issues and I have the same problem... :(
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Spoolin6er » Tue May 26, 2015 6:00 am

No ideas on the resets?
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Re: Maxima COP Triggering

Postby Matt Cramer » Fri May 29, 2015 7:31 am

It could be that the way you built your circuit was feeding so much power to the coils that the voltage would dip unacceptably low. Try a 100 ohm resistor inline with the spark outputs.
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