BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

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NukeKS14
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BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

Image
Image
(pre fuel-upgrade picture)
Image

Calculated comp. ratio-> 9.59:1 (10 mils off head/deck for flatness)
Wiseco 9.0:1 pistons, .020 over
Manley H-beam rods
ARP main/rod studs
Calico coated ACL rod and Clevite77 main bearings
Tomei 1.0mm headgasket
rotating assy fully balanced
BC Stage 2 cams on OEM valvesprings.

ID1050x injectors in Radium top mount rail (Base fuel pressure set to 50#)
Aeromotive 340lph in-tank fuel pump, hard wired.
MSPNP2 ECU
Maxima COP conversion running BKR7E-11s at .044 gap

CXRacing 11ga ex manifold, downpipe converted to 90mm V-band
3" Turbo-back (no cat)
Turbosmart 45mm wastegate, open dump
BorgWarner S257 SX-E .82 A/R ex housing.

I was previously running an Ebay T3-T4 and I can't describe how much of an improvement this Borg Warner is. I would highly encourage anyone to check our their matchbot app if you're looking into upgrading turbos.

Can't wait to get the chassis sorted so I can get on track with this.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by TwoDoorDime »

This car must be an absolute riot with that power! any pictures of the car itself?
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NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

https://forums.nicoclub.com/introductio ... 23712.html

Half assed build thread on nico.

Its a hoot but i'm taking it easy on the stock tranny and axles. I have a N/A Z32 tranny and diff sourced i just need to go pull them. J30 axles w better rzeppa cv joints and game on.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by TwoDoorDime »

Oh i see an LS fan as well. I was a GM tech for years, have a few LS powered cars. Great s14!
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NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

Thanks. My dad has worked for GM the past 30+ years so i got a ton of incentives. Had hoped to best it with the 240s output but i did not. I am within about 15whp though.

I have a Backdraft AC cobra replica finding a home in my garage eventually with a SBF 392 as well. I have an affinity for greasy rwd cars with gobs of torque (that also handle well). Not brand loyal at all but I keep coming back to Nissans for some reason.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by TwoDoorDime »

I am in the same boat! My foxbody sits right next to my LS swapped rx7 and it next to my single turbo rotary rx7 etc etc. I don't care about the brand just like rwd cars. I mostly like beaters but have had some nice cars as well.

At what power level did you hurt the stock bottom end?
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NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

No dyno numbers, tooling around with the MS. Went out on a summer day to dial in the ebc. Aimed for 10# and touched 12 on a boost spike when boost cut kicked in. Damage was done. Got home to find a quart and a half of oil had fled my engine by way of the valve cover breather. Guessing you saw the pic. It wasnt horrific. Pulled ugly compression numbers and knew the gig was up. Im pretty convinced it was binding from thermal expansion, too small of gaps. Just some hairline cracks on the ringlands for 1 and 3 cylinders.

The dueling walboro setup PO had in the fuel tank didnt help. If youre going to y pipe two fuel pumps use check valves kids!
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by p00t »

Great numbers and nice build. What was different between the ebay turbo and the Borgwarner?

Definitely worth letting it wind up to 7k by the looks of it.
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NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

My IP address keeps getting blocked for some reason...


Thanks for the kind words.

The China-bay turbo was a claimed T3/T4, .63 A/R stamped on exhaust housing. I fought and fought to keep the 5 bolt exhaust flange on the downpipe from leaking at the turbo. It also surged pretty badly any time I even thought about letting off on the throttle. Bov is plumbed in to the hot pipe maybe a foot and a half from the compressor. I think it was a turbo issue. I'm skeptical of what the ACTUAL A/R and trim of that turbo are. I am too lazy now but I may go out with a micrometer this winter and do some measuring and figure out for myself.

I think most people aren't well versed in the BW sizing so I'll compare it to Garrett; This BW is right at I believe a GT 3076, maybe a touch larger, with 90mm V-band conversion. .82 A/R exhaust housing in this case.

Big differences I noticed immediately were the exhaust note, anti-surge comp housing has eliminated surge, and the powerband. I can hear the cams at idle, there is a little bit of a lope now. Not anything like the LS in my camaro but I can tell it's there where I couldn't hear anything before. And it's deeper and a bit louder. On the T3/T4 I was in boost at cruise on the highway pretty much. I cruised at a higher throttle position as well. Now, I'll cruise at 80-85Mph at 20% or less throttle and at a decent amount of vacuum. (55-70 kPa ish) I can tell the engine is breathing a lot better. Visual comparison of the exhaust housing says everything. I feel the car pull strongly and smoothly through to redline now. I don't know it's a truly analogous comparison as I wasn't running a quality T3T4 but I won't go back. I could see maybe going to an EFR bb turbo from BW in many years but this is perfect for now. I don't feel like there was an appreciable difference in spool. I can tell maybe 200-400rpm difference in delay but the turbo still only has less than 5k miles on it.


I plotted the compressor map from 2k to 7k RPM in 1000RPM increments. points are 5, 10, 18x3 and the 7kRPM plot is at 28psi to see what the 'ceiling' is on this turbo.
Image

We weren't seeing IAT get above 90s on the dyno (my sensor is in the cold pipe, just at the outlet of the intercooler.) Tells me that compressor map is pretty accurate as I'm running the el cheapo EMUSA FMIC that came on the car.

exhaust housing for illustration
Image
NukeKS14
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October update (407HP | 398 ft/lbs)

Post by NukeKS14 »

So I got busy and never got around to actually updating this for my new setup. My CX manifold cracked at the collector where the wastegate is. I said screw it and did what I should have done in the first place, and ordered a good quality Full-Race manifold. I also switched to a .78 A/R divided hotside. I gained a TON of spool and torque throughout the powerband with the Full-Race twin scroll manifold. Then I blew up my stock KA transmission 2 days later (passing a semi in 5th.) She's got a VG transmission from a 1994 NA Z32 now and is running stronger than ever. I'm hitting 21 PSI on straight pump gas. It's ridiculous how responsive this setup is.

Image

The orange curve is my old peak run on the CX manifold and .82 A/R undivided housing. Peak torque went up 16 ft lbs but everything comes on about 300 RPM sooner and it's available throughout the powerband. I'll be upgrading to Tomei cam gears next year and shifting to an E85 tune. The engine runs smooth to redline now which is actually 7500 RPM but power is falling off quite a bit after 6500ish.

Still running .044" gap on the spark plugs (BKR7E-11s) on the Maxima coils with no blowout at 21psi. Solid setup. Excited to see what next spring has in store when I can get back to the brakes and suspension.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by alan-n »

Great stuff this will be the turbo I'll be going with on my rebuild with z33 transmission. Something with quick spool for HPDE track days.

Alan
'95 240SX; BW S366; S257 SXE; Kelford 272/272
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

Hey where did you get that exhaust housing...I want it...
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BW S257 SX-E .78AR
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TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

https://www.ebay.com/itm/T3-Divided-Tur ... 5ec424a071

It seems they raised the price a little but thats the same seller. Acceleratedtube.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

R34SR wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:13 pm Hey where did you get that exhaust housing...I want it...
Forgot to mention, you'll have to give that info to full-race for your downpipe (if you're having them make one.) Here's what I gave to Jay @ full-race and my downpipe fit perfectly;

" v-band flange with a 3.75” (95mm) outer diameter."

shoot me a PM I can forward the email string to you if you like.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

Tanks man but I"ve made a few downpipes so far and I've gotten pretty comfy with it so I'll save $400 right there...not attempting a manifold anytime soon though. Would you say you very much prefer the smaller AR setup? I have 272 cams and response is important.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
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Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

On the 264s, I really do with the twin scroll manifold. I came out with 7 less peak HP but way more torque and at least 300RPM earlier on peak boost. I can still run it out to 7500 RPM but I need to get those Tomei cam gears and degree the cams and I don't think it'll die off so badly up top after 6800ish RPM. I get better response out of this than the smaller chinese t3t4 I had on the car. It's fantastic how efficient this turbo is.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

Yea Its your dyno sheets that are forcing me to get rid of my holset hx35 .63 ar setup.....somehow your setup with that bigger turbo is breaking 200wtq before I am!....my manifold won't be ready for weeks/months I assume, so when I go back to Florida I'll try to put a solid tune on the hx35 setup and share with you guys for comparison sake....I guess it's not apples to apples though because It would be nice to see what the hx35 with a true twin scroll setup is like......but old tech is old tech....glad to finally upgrade to a modern setup.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

Will be nice to see for a look at least. Keep in mind, I'm bored .020" over and my compression ratio is 9.59:1 from what I calculated using Tomei's tool and info from my machinist for the head/deck. Without the EBC working (12 psi), a friend of mine who drove it said it feels just like a standard KA out of boost, but never quits pulling. That was the goal, something with great transient response and torque on demand. On 21# with the EBC turned on it will straight throw you back in the seat too.

http://tomeiusa.com/_2003web-catalogue/gasket_crc.html

^that's the tool I'm talking about. The turbo is fantastic though. Very very efficient. It's like a T3/T4 on steroids.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

I'm sold on it...just always working in cali, the house and garage are in FL....so everything takes forever to get done.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

Close to ordering my S257, I just realized you never got a chance to test your .82 AR housing with your twin scroll manifold....granted I assume you didn't have a twin scroll housing on the .82 setup correct?

Just wondering if your power is falling off up top because the housing is too small or if its cam related.
I don't see anyone selling a t3 .8X AR housing for the S200 series....real street is selling a .75 then the next step is a 1.0 and 1.25AR.

so far looks like ill have to get the identical setup you are running.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

I did not test out the non-divided housing on the full-race manifold I think it may be falling off a bit because of the different A/R but I also dialed back timing a little more to aid spool up front. I can tell you my butt dyno doesn't notice the 'missing' 7 peak HP one bit but I can absolutely tell a difference from the earlier spool and additional torque down low. Thought never crossed my mind to put the .82 A/R housing back on.

Having said that, I'm working on redoing my wiring and some components in my fuel system this winter. If budget allows, I'd like to add an ATi superdamper and Tomei cam gears and actually degree them. swirlpot, additional fuel pump, plumbing,and Radium FPR are going to eat up a majority of it. Engine pulls smooth as butter up to 7500. Just runs out of breath a bit. I'm willing to bet I can remedy that with the cam gears and find more power on the corn.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

Your parts, build, and thoughts seem to constantly mirror mine...I have the radium rail sitting on a shelf, but haven't run up the limit on my current 750s yet ( I'm sure the new setup will)..ATI damper is my current priority , I'd be interested to see what the cam gears do for you....I degreed my cams ( tomei 272) and found them to be exactly where recommended on the stock gears. I have a feeling that if you had an 82 AR twin scroll housing...you may gain everything back up top and possibly not loose anything/minimal down low.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

So I just spoke to Jay over at full race, and after discussing my goals 400 to 450whp....he's suggesting a 1.0 Ar....he's says a .75 AR will net my goals just fine but power will fall after 6500rpm.....exactly what's happening to you.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

Good to know
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

I'm contemplating going with the 1.0ar just to see what difference it makes in top end power since low end torque doesn't seem to be much of an issue for you...I figure If it loses 300 rpm spool but can rev without loss to 7500 would be fantastic.....I have supertech valve train and tomei cams. My other concern is the headlift issues most folks have after 400wtq, I don't feel like pulling the motor to install larger studs along with the washers recommended to remedy the issue so I'll try to manage the torque through AR sizing and tuning to stay at 400tq or below. Ati damper on the list too.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

yeah keep us posted. I'm interested to see how it comes out. I'm going to keep tooling with this thing and if it lets go, I may sell my setup or give it to Marcus and move on to an LS or RB powered setup. I hope to touch 500Hp or close to it on e85 but I'm really happy where it's at now.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

RB25/26 was always my dream...as you can see my username is R34, and up to about a year and half ago I was planning it....I grew up watching my dad drive a 95 nissan laurel with an rb25de in south america ( badass car). But with the cost increases lately and knowing what a junkyard LS is capable of....it's hard to justify the rb other than for the sake of nostalgia.

And don't hold your breath, probably be 6 months before I get a chance to go back to FL and do any work on the 240.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

She's on jackstands for the winter. I'm redoing wiring, fuel system, and intake manifold (maybe brakes if I can get off my ass.) all the time in the world here.
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Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by R34SR »

May I suggest ctsv front calipers...I love them, price can't be beat.
MEGASQUIRT 2 PNP
AEM IGN1A COILS
EAGLE-ARP-SUPERTECH 9:1 KA24DE
BW S257 SX-E .78AR
ID1050x Injectors
Full Race twin scroll manifold
ISIS FMIC
Mazworx z32 tranny swap
CTS V CALIPERS
STANCE LX+ Coilovers
J30 LSD
AME FS01 WHEELS 18X9 +25



TinyT wrote:for the love of god, post your setup, do you really think you can get an answer after saying HI ME CAR HAS TURBO NOW BUT I CANT BWAAA PSHH WITH IT WHATS WRONG
NukeKS14
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Posts: 157
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 8:33 pm
Location: Northeastern KS

Re: BW S257SX-E 412WHP/383TQ @ 18.5#, 93Octane

Post by NukeKS14 »

Image

Just finished powdercoating some z32 30mm irons. Will be paired with z33 brembo front rotors and 1" z32 bmc. I have ctsv 6 pot fronts on my 4000lb camaro and they are appropriate, maybe a little overkill there. These withn good pads and the larger brembo z33 rotors are going to be just fine, maybe with some naca ducts for the track.
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